Newcastle 2050: What if?

Especially like parks and stuff. Let's assume by 2050 we've cracked fusion energy and energies too. Especially in winter, I come from a tropical country, so when it gets dark early I go like, you know, I need more sunlight. What if we could light up places like parks to be like almost like certain parks away from houses. It could be almost like daytime kind of thing. So if I miss it out in the morning at work, I can go after work, I can take my kids to a place that's almost like a sunlight. We work in offices, by 5 o'clock I come out and it's dark, I'm going to be like, I missed out on lighting. How much do we consider the natural world with that though? Because that will disrupt the innocent reptiles and other... Yeah, that's true. Like for a night time economy, for me, I'm not a very going out at night person. But I would go out at night if there were nighttime activities in nature, like night diving. Or going out and looking for like glow in the dark mushrooms in Glenrock, for example. Things like that, like how can we get people to enjoy nature in all the different contexts from daytime to nighttime. Because there's so much that comes alive. I'm there as well. In 2050, I feel like I would like to see a vibrant city, but at the same time, still have a really thriving, biodiverse, rich ecosystem in... Yeah, yeah, yeah. Bike rides in Glenrock at night. I used to do that quite a bit. It's quite an experience. Yeah, okay. Alright. Who wants to go next? No? Want me to read it out? What makes a place feel safe and welcoming at night? It's definitely down to the lighting. Lighting, yeah. Because at Newcastle West in particular, like one national, a lot of those people moving in there are baby boomers. Yeah, yeah. But they don't feel safe in the area, so there's lots of exceptions around McDonald's. There's lots of crimes, lots of work. There's not much police presence. And it's also really hard to see around that marble town at night. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's also hard for them to commute from Civic Plaza up there and help go through all those sections of registration. Yeah, okay. So, a lot of that is safety and perception. And same way at the beach, so you have a lot of Muslims go there after dark. And just being able to transcend along that waterway and along the beach, more lighting or even artistic lighting. Like in Singapore or overseas, you'll see a lot more artistic lighting, so it doesn't just wrap the birds. Yeah, yeah. But it brings activity there. But yeah, lighting, safety and perception are the biggest ones to tackle. Yeah, okay. Recently they decided to put surveillance on the street. Yeah, I did read that. Would that change your perception of safety? Did you say surveillance? Yeah. Only if something actually happens with it, and I think that's a challenge. And I do think sometimes our perceptions are out of alignment with the reality of the situation. And I think, you know, there are certainly parts of the media that feeds the negative. And I think we are probably hearing more than we used to. And therefore, you know, the negative feelings that come with that. So I think you always have to be sifting what is reality and what is just news. I am very, very close to the CCTV thing. It was driven by the Business Improvement Association, which is funded. So that's my main goal is to look after businesses. And I've only joined the city in October. Since every single meeting I've been there, the business is there. We need CCTV. We need CCTV. Like, someone has done this to my window. Someone has done that to my window. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. The hope is knowing that people are being observed, it's going to change. It's access to territory. And the funny thing is a lot of the issues that come up don't really happen at night. It's during the daytime. Yeah, yeah, yeah. When there's less people around in Vermont Street. When night, when there's a lot of people around, the anti-social elements typically can be pulled away. Yeah, yeah. It's a lack of people that makes them a bit more involved. Which goes back to the question. What would make you consider a lot of people? Yeah. People. Yeah, people. Sorry, my point is I feel like for a lot of people night life is drinking. Yeah, yeah. It's definitely a more safe environment. I feel like there should be some healthy activities. Either something related to nature or sport or something. Yeah. So it's a perception issue. Yeah, perception issue. And it is reality as well. They are coming straight out of the park. Yeah. To the streets. So if you are 75 or 80, you don't... Yeah. I do think that critical mass of people does shift that way. And I think if you think about a city like Brisbane and the south north area, you know, the pubs are definitely there. I mean, Brisbane is a city that's not unlike Newcastle in some kind of southern terms of its culture. So the pubs and the drinking is there, but there's so many people in that area with so many different reasons. The views and the restaurants and the events that happen there. But I think, you know, because there's that balance of older people and families, you're going to make it feel more dispersed on the number of people who are there for the drinking culture. Yeah. All right. Well, that actually links into this question. Because we're mentioning sort of, you know, older people. Who does Newcastle's night currently serve well and who is in the village? Well, it serves going out to drinking fans. Going out to drink fans, I guess. Yeah. And foodies. It's a good foodie place. Yeah. There's a lot of good restaurants that are well known. Darby Street and Honey Sutherland. Yeah. And that can sort of, I think, from possibly studying the Darby, you know, 60 and under, maybe the older generation above that aren't as comfortable. I'm not too sure. But I guess the problem is we've done developments and price points where the majority of the people living within Newcastle CBD now, aren't families. They're prestatiously. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So the majority of people buying apartments in town are 65 and older in the town. They've got huge money, which is great to spend. Yeah. But it's like, how can you make it easier for families to get into town and be part of that culture? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. I mean, yeah. Like, yeah, real estate and pricing of real estate and all that sort of stuff is a big issue. And how do you cater to different demographics is a good solution? Well, just the ease of access. So families do come in. Is it unprogrammed, like, spaces that aren't going to cost you? Yeah. Someone complained a bit the other day about this. I know Sonny Boy and they're in the park. They said, as a family with my two kids, I went there. Coffee's a nine bucks each and then we had to buy a sandwich. And they were like, well, that was a $35 card. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. So if we are talking about families coming in, yeah. And is it, like, is the park going to be lit at night? Is it successful at night? Is it all the pictures going to work at night? Yeah, yeah. Day? What was that? I said day. I said day. It's nowhere to go with it. Yeah. Well, I can tell you, the one recent business that actually said that they are doing very well recently was Escaping. Hiya. In the city near Towers of Massim. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They're like, it's great. You know, we're getting more demand. I'm like, ah, okay. This, I guess, goes back to my original point where it's about changing the product to meet the customers. Yeah, yeah. Who it leaves out, I would agree. With children, I would say, if I had my kids around, where would I take them at night? Besides the movies, not much. Yeah. The new park, will that have lighting and everything? Is that successful at night? The new park, the park, is that the stage? I don't know. I'm not sure. I'm not sure. I'm not sure, actually. Because that's going to be fantastic at night. Yeah, that would be a perfect place. And then you've got the station, you're going to have the brewery and all the restaurants in the station and the redevelopment of the wall. So that's going to bring a lot of people to that precinct. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then you've got the rest of the stage three east end coming together and that will clean up onto students. Yeah, yeah. Well, maybe we can, just to break it up a little bit. Do we want to each take a token and let's have a vote of, ah, guess what we think's important? - Good morning.

I do like those undercutors, how bummed are we that sports girls got down in there? Yes, yes, yes, what's left? The thing is, where are we not including Vermont Street? So yeah, Vermont's out, so it's just, yeah, Newcastle, it's like a street mall. Yeah, it's like, where's the street mall? It's just like, probably looking right at me. Oh, so there. Oh wow, excellent. Okay, so yellow is, yellow is open. It goes to Newcommon Street. Yeah. So it ends there at all. Yeah, we're thinking here. That's the part. Yeah, that's the part. And then obviously write down anything you feel Newcastle is missing. So, lacking. Lacking, yeah. One thing for me personally being in, obviously, the all-time economy and also events and music festivals is an ideal outdoor space to watch the live music show. Yeah. Whether it be 5,000. Yeah. Whether it be 5,000. When we're kind of, we're in discussions with the council, like, where is the ideal space to put that? I mean, I'll put shows on at the, at the, at the station, but that's now being taken over. It's got a new lessee that are going to be doing, like, the Gastroparb and F&B. Yeah. You know, I've done a festival down here on the foreshore, which is good, but thinking of, you know, large events bring people into the city that obviously activate the night-time economy. So they're good for so many reasons. Yeah. They can be disruptive, but, you know, for me personally, like, if I was having my ideal night out, it would be...

Yeah, yeah. Excellent. Any other ideas? It's like a Sunday, Sunday, whatever it is, and it's like once a month, and all the vendors just get to come into different restaurants, and we've got a little market, and it's shut down, like, Key Street is walking over, and everyone just gets to bring their food back and go nuts. Yeah. Anybody else? Any other ideas? I think it would be cool to have, maybe like themed in a way that's not like a place that you go, but like a phone-free event of sorts. Oh, I like that. I went to one of those. Sorry. Yeah, they're great. Everyone can kind of like, everyone's got technology everywhere, like everything, and it's a beautiful thing, but it also treats us in the foot. Yeah. You know, it'd just be cool to kind of have more of those sorts of, there was one at Urban Distillery a couple of weeks ago, and they like, they block out your phone when you're open. Little sticker on the back. Like your cameras, and like obviously that's like the four wall stints in it, but I don't know, it's just cool. And you talk to people. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, cause I mean, we're social animals, yeah? Yeah, yeah. COVID taught us that. We need to interact. So generally you need someone to drive this, right? Yeah. You need someone to get in there and actually burn the boats and do the thing. Definitely. So. The thing we were talking about in the previous group was, I actually, so I was born here and raised in Newcastle. Newcastle's funny, cause it's sort of like, we've got Derby street, the Bowman street, the foreshore. Yeah. It's sort of in these little isolated pockets. And we were talking about, wouldn't it be cool to have like, even things like colour football and lighting that connects it all. Yeah. Absolutely. So you generate like those interconnectivities and network effects that generate critical mass. Yeah? Yeah. Yeah. Do we want to consider some more sort of questions? Let's have a look. Yeah. Ah, this is a good one. I like this one. What night, particularly in an era of inflation, yeah? What nighttime experiences matter to you that don't involve spending money? Zero. Karaoke. Yeah? You've always got to spend money? The late night swims at the baths. Ahh. Excellent. Love that. At full moon. Today's a good day. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it is. The full moon down at the bars is super busy. It's great. A late night bike ride. A late night bike ride? Yeah. Yeah. What else? But even a pre-contra media, there's a pretty big part of it. They do. Yeah. The cinema under the stars events happen. Yeah. Definitely. Yeah. I mean, one thing with that is then it links into things like transport. Yeah. Yeah? How do we get there? How do we move from, if you live in the suburbs, like me, you've got two kids. How do we get from A to B? I think that's a very important thing of like, how do we get from A to B? Yeah. How do you get things going in the suburbs? Yeah. Because it can't just be in the city. In the city. Yeah, yeah. So it might be, like with the Fringe Festival there's like, loads of things happening at like, in the suburbs as well. Yeah. So that might be something to like. Yeah. So try and build like a hub in a sort of suburb? Yeah. Like March is merry weather month and there's things happening. That's a great idea. Yeah. March is merry weather month. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Of course. What other questions do we have here? Ah, so this is basically the opposite. What night time experiences are you willing to spend money on and how much? Live music. Live music? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'd love to go out. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's so awful. Oh. There's a whole bane. Yeah. There's plenty of places. There's the Lass, which is amazing. The Lass is queer friendly. It's gorgeous. But like, when it's pissing rain and there's only a beer garden, it's kinda hard to be like. Is it? Yeah. The Lass. The Lass O'Gallery? Yeah. Right there downstairs. It's in Wickham behind the train station. Wickham? It's really fun. Wickham. It's like right behind. It's like next to the interchange. So if you come out of the interchange from Sydney, you turn left and then you walk up those streets there. The basement, the underground? There's jazz, jazz jazz. But then if you, yeah, King Street is like 18 year olds. 18 to 24. And it's like when you're in your mid-30s class, you're like, I really want to, King Street. King Street, yeah. It's like an over 25s club actually. Underage venues as well. When I was growing up, I used to go to like underage discos. Yeah. At the moment, Newcastle is very much missing youth venues. Yeah, or even just. Because the kids are on the street causing issues. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's nowhere for them to go. If they don't have where to listen to music, they have nowhere to go. Well, it's like 18 to 25 is pretty catered for, right? Yeah, where's 14 to 18? And then it's like 25 plus, and then 14 to 18. So it's like, I want to go out and listen to bands. I don't want to go to King Street and deal with someone that's vomiting on their shoes. Yeah. Or vomiting in the line. Or who's had like OD. It's like, I've been there, don't have fun. You go to the Rogue or Bernie's or Charlie's. Yeah. That's the whole part. Is there, someone was telling me, so I remember when I was going out, not that long ago, but there was like student nights. Are there still student nights? No. No, there isn't. Students are working four jobs and trying to keep food on the table. Yeah. Right. They're not drinking. They're not drinking. They're not drinking. They're not drinking. They're drinking. They're not drinking. They're drinking. They went from like $31 million in revenue from gambling to $3 million in Gen Z. Yeah. Which is wild. Which is funny because. I put up this prompt here. Like what would an ideal look like for a 17 year old who doesn't want to drink? Yeah. Which is quite a common kind of type at the moment. Well, they're also like at the bars and they're like, they're ordering, ordering matches and they're sitting there listening to music on their Yui Booms. Like they're. Yeah. That's. They're in the bar. Or in Australia. I feel like there's a lot of space lacking in Newcastle for them. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. They go to the bars, they go like around Manchester. Yeah. I don't know. Yeah. Like they're lacking those spaces that are, that are cooked, right? Yeah. They don't want to spend money either. Like it's either spending money. Or they don't have money to spend also. Yeah. Yeah. And that's what they've noticed that when, when Gen Zed, especially older Gen Zeds actually get into jobs where they have money, they do start drinking again. Yeah. It's just that they can't afford it. It's just that they can't afford it. Yeah. That's the only thing stopping them. It's not a moral thing. Yeah. Which they can't afford to. Yeah. Okay. I mean, I guess that's sort of links in this. I mean, yeah. What makes a place feel safe and welcoming at night? Lighting. People. Exactly. Yeah. The culture. Yeah. Yeah. It's like a critical movement. Yeah. It's like a critical movement. Yeah. They need less laws. Yeah. Make it easier to get a license for a pop-up bar. Yeah. Yeah. And like seats on the paper and stuff like that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It is absolutely. It is absolutely. It's a business. And that welcomes people to the area. It's a very safe place. The public wants this. Like, Laura and I were thinking about opening a little bar on Hunter Street in December last year, but it was like, it's so expensive and it's so difficult to get a bar license. And we wanted to do it for summer. Yeah. Just to be like, small plates, nice wine from Vera wine, and it's like a super cute Parisian bar. public want this like Laura and I were thinking about opening a little bar on Hunter Street in December last year but it was like it's so expensive and it's so difficult to get a bar license and we wanted to do it for summer just to be like small plates nice wine from Vera wine and it's like a super cute Parisian bar and people want that and people that are like you know 30 plus want to have that you know like they want to do that they're like get a babysitter for the night let's go have a cute dinner and go out for a dance whatever so it's finding those little things we need more variety but like the council needs to also allow people that have these ideas and these this vibe and they want to bring the vibrancy back into Newcastle to be like can we do this okay that's what we're working on in Midtown with the special entertainment racing so New South Wales state government have a way of classifying an area not individual DAs so if you're in that area you just follow the one DA so everyone can use sound up to a certain level everyone can use internal staircases like some of the criteria on DAs like some say they can't serve energy drinks some aren't allowed to have mirror balls in there like because it's just ridiculous so mirror ball yeah mirror ball like a disco ball everybody wants one bar why is a disco ball print um there was some weird thing where some of them thought it was an epilepsy race ah um yeah so there's all of these things so basically you can do one special entertainment precinct license anyone within that area can follow that license so if you're a business or own a business within that area you just follow that license and that saves about it saves individual businesses about 600 or 120 thousand dollars per business in fees for DAs, sound reports, engineering reports, all of that sort of thing so at the moment it's currently being discussed by the council because it has to be passed by council in order to enact that state government stuff in New South Wales yeah but could it like if you know it's like a new idea of just having like in like a city centre or something like experimented in zones well that's that would be what that zone is you could then open up you go to this zone you know exactly what it is you just follow what it is you don't have to do like yeah and also have like month on so it's like if someone has that business and an empty venue and it's so good yeah you know we activate different products yeah also look for the person that owns like a landlord they're going all right cool every three months i have a new person coming in and paying this rent it's a consistent rent with a different vibe every three months yeah i think that's really good what's that like what hunter renew or a new renewal yeah that was like well they should renew renew yeah what if you crowdfunded like it would be the type of thing where it's just like okay you want to do a pop-up or pop-up yeah let's call it a pop-up and it's just like oh well i want to do that like shit is anyone going to show up well what if you like had some sort of website and it's just like okay when a thousand people bought a drink they bought a ten dollar drink yeah and they get a voucher they get a voucher and all of a sudden you've got a thousand people thousand people send you a ten grand you're like all right well i know well now that's the fit out yeah exactly but you know what i mean i get enough of that and it's kind of like it depends which venue you're going into though like to be honest we started burning our credit card yeah like we we had not much money at all we talked to the landlord into giving us zero rent for the first three of months and no bond yeah and we just like bring it to us and it happened she said you know what fuck it yeah let's go we could show the idea and we were able to start the bar but they've also got an amazing landlord there's so many landlords right absolutely not yeah too much risk what if it flops and then i'm out of pocket and then my venue's being damaged yeah exactly there is a lot of things we've got about ten minutes left in this room i encourage you to maybe make a little swap or maybe have a look over there in the back if you haven't yet and just

You can attract a lot of people with a couple of food trucks and a margarita van. If you're at home one day and you've got a food idea, obviously you can go over to New York and all the food trucking, that's where the fads start. It's an idea. A big focus on Queen's Wharf, they're doing some work there. They had it at Surfest, there were those food trucks and they had a nice Statenwood beer at 10. That was lovely. If they hadn't done one time, that would be amazing. That's during the day and night time, that stuff can exist as well. Late night markets, food, people experience the city, they start at 5, go home at 10 or they go from 10 o'clock to 3. At our venue we have a night called In Med Before 10 and it's designed now, people go out, they have dinner, they drink, they come and dance in the nightclub and they leave a tent and garden. People are experiencing it differently. What venue? It's King Street, I own that one. So I have that, Argyle House, which is Fanny's, we just have the Cambridge, we've got a bunch of restaurants and I do festivals. I do Howland Country, I do some events at the university outdoors there. They were talking before, one of the girls was talking about how she goes to King Street Hotel even though she's in her thirties because she loves the live music. Yeah, there's a part there. And that's what I love about the Barbeach part thing, you know, they have young guy, young girl, whatever, duets, singing. Just pop up in the park and sing. Yeah, and so many people are there. There will be more, like obviously Victoria Theatre is opening up soon, which will be a live, which will be a theatre. you know, that's, that'll be, uh, uh, you know,

It's a typical night out for you and what I'd like to do is if you've lived in Newcastle for a long time, your night out when you were 18 to what it probably is now would be significantly different. So some people are going from 5 to 10pm, what does that night look like? Then from 10 o'clock to 3 o'clock is a little bit different. So what we've been trying to do is what your night would look like and then also what's a good kind of idea is like if you had someone in a state or has ever been in Newcastle, what would that look like? How would you show Newcastle off to them? I know what I know exactly. I know the roads I go down, I know where I take them and I reckon most people would probably bring them around here, down to Horseshoe, along the wharf and we show them all those spots. I park up interchange and catch the light well through the city just to kind of explore it. So, you know, you can either, you can start with that, what that ideal journey would be or also what you typically do. I just find being locals, like, you'll just do, you go, oh, that's what I do. I go to that bar and that restaurant and I go home. Then maybe think about if there was an event on, if there was an outdoor show or something, how would you navigate through the city, you know? And then if you had something like identify the red, where's a place where you particularly probably wouldn't go or wouldn't recommend? And then the blue is something that has future potential. Where's an area that you think we should explore more, whether it be down Queens Wharf where we can put a bunch of night markets or it could be little food pop-ups, things like Queenstown have a really good, on the water they've got all these like little food kiosks so that people can go in there and try new cuisines and things. Like maybe that could be an area that we need to put some movement in. It could be, oh, people have been putting stuff in Stockton where they just think it's beautiful and fair, but there's nothing there other than the kids' park, you know, outdoor bars and restaurants. And these are just ideas. If you think there's a future potential with the blue, pick up one of the cards and also write down what that idea might look like and drop it some ideas of being outdoor amphitheatres, like a live music kind of thing, the city kind of likes that, because that drives, it drives visitation, it drives people to the city. And when people do and experience an event, they experience the city in such a different way than what we do on a weekend. And people that haven't been to Newcastle here, you know, they would experience it differently if they were going to a festival or the civic theatre or, you know, going to an event here at the uni. So that's how we can use the kind of colour codes. So, you know, everyone will experience it differently. So go through and do that. And then obviously, yeah, the other ones, what was it? Yeah, yeah, obviously, what should exist at night in Newcastle, food precincts, night swimming, obviously, silent spaces, it should be, people are putting, using the surf clubs as well, activating them a lot more freely, whether it be like the kitchens being, you know, cleaned up and the council's paying for things so people can do pop-up restaurants along there to use that space, night markets. You know, anything that you feel, personally, that we're missing, yeah. And yes, have some fun. So I don't know if anyone can kick it off. I know what my nights are significantly different now from when I was 18. What does it look like now? What does it look like now? Yeah, it's fantastic. I think it's changed, like, listen, back 20 years ago, we had more nightclubs. Now we've got more run clubs than nightclubs. Is that a good thing or a bad thing? I think people are doing it differently. So sitting at Lampton Park Hotel, people go around Lampton Park and then they come in, have one drink, and then they go around, run another, and I was like, ooh. That's a big thing. I think it's so different. It's changed. Like, there's pub clubs. Like, pubs can trade later, so therefore they'll have a DJ and people will just go out differently. The whole kind of rite of passage of hitting a nightclub, like, back in the day, at 12 o'clock, it would shut, and then you'd all go, and they'd tick those boxes. But they're just, they're going out differently, and there's more options. You know, there's more options on their device, at home, and I think through COVID, yeah, it changed. Obviously, we had three venues operating on a Wednesday night doing student nights, and not one exists now. There's no student night, which is a really big thing in Newcastle. I think when you go to university here, part of it is going out and doing that, and I find that concerning, that that doesn't exist. And I really feel when I go to the uni and do shows, I'm like, you guys don't, you're missing out on this big movement when you were young. And, like, when they're at home, and they're just doing it differently. It costs too much for them these days. Yeah, bring back the $2 shots. Well, yeah. Our power, yeah. Like, it does and it doesn't. Like, you know, we'll do a student night soon, and our venue will be $8 drinks. I still think that, and we still do $8 drinks on Friday night, free entry, but they just... I mean, like, the wages haven't gone enough. Like, I remember going out on a student night, it used to be $4. Yeah, it was. It was, but a lot of these students, they're at home. You know, they're staying at home longer. Like, are they working hard enough? You know, if you want to go out, you just get another job. You know, I think that... You sound like the average first guy. There is a lot, but, like, there is affordable options for them. If people go out, they don't have to drink to enjoy themselves. We have a lot of... We have a night that's in bed before 10, and it shuts at 10 o'clock, and it's packed. Then people don't drink. They go out, experience music, and they go home. So, it is different like that. People are doing it differently, and I think, you know, from... We haven't had many 18, like, most of the people putting down their... Yeah, things. Most of the people putting down their things are, obviously, restaurants, nighttime. But I think it's not much late-night kind of movement happening on the board. But, yeah, it's in a good spot. I think Newcastle is very... The thing about Newcastle, we've got a lot of live music venues as well. We're just not so connected. You know what I mean? It's just not... We're close, but not. It feels like you've got to get there, you've got to get there. And that's one thing to connect, like, say, Hamilton to Midtown and the East. Like, the light rail does such a good job, but I'm like, just not. We're just not there. And I don't... Like, whether or not it's nighttime markets and there's, you know, food events and things like that. That will connect people walking from one part to the other. But, you know, it's interesting. So, put down. Like, if you were bringing a friend, where would you take them? Your favourite restaurant. Go watch a show. Or you go to the Civic Theatre. Or you go for a swim at night. You know, so there's some things. And obviously, the places you would avoid at, you know, you wouldn't send them. You know what I'd like to see? There's been so much talk about this place being developed as a venue. And after Cambridge got shut down... Is that Marathon? Yeah. Yeah. It's the Hope does awesome. There's so many bars around there. Why are we not activating that space? Yeah. The Newcastle Station was a good one as well. Is that the place there now that's been taken over? And that'll be like a... Plane Cycle's good. Plane Cycle's good. The station will be like a pub, a wedding venue. Put boutique accommodation there. That precinct's pretty good. There's the... So, what do the colours mean again? Where you have been in the past? Yeah. What does your night used to look like? And then what does it currently do? And probably do one where you would bring a friend that's never been in Newcastle. And along the way, like, you know, the red dots are the places you probably would avoid. And then if there's anything we're missing, like, that you feel in Newcastle, just write the idea down. Let's, you know, put it on the paper, put it on the board. Is this the Newcastle post office right here? Yeah. Yeah. Let's get that. Turn that into something. They have started that. Have they actually? I've heard about it since I was in uni. They're, like, beautiful sandstone, double-storey buildings. They've just started. And that'll be, like, a cafe, an Aboriginal, like, museum, cultural museum. Okay. And I think we're going for some weird, like, just different retail shops in there. The guy who owns that owns a lot of hotels in Newcastle. So how far off is our Newcastle? They've just started the DA, but, like, it's so, it's heritage and, like, they just had to activate the DA. Which means put a hammer in the wall and he could delay it. Yeah. Like, I don't know. Because that's the sad, as a fairly recent newcomer to Newcastle, just walking past our post office. It's sad. It's been there for a long time. It is beautiful. Yeah, it's beautiful. Heritage, we own a heritage building, which is a nightclub called Argyle House. Well, Fanny's nightclub. And that's now shut. Is that a house now? Not yet. We had it as a nightclub for many years and we just couldn't make it work. And we just shut it. We didn't make, we didn't mention anything. We didn't do any social media posts. That's where I went when I was 18. Yeah, that was, you know, and. Rite of passage. And then no one, it was a rite of passage and it's just gone. And we didn't mention it and it's just gone. And so right now. That was one of the last places that had, like, like a, like a real busy uni night. Yeah, it was. And we fought, like, and we lost a lot of money doing cheap, like, doing cheap drinks and free entries and eventually. But that whole area, like, we always firmly believe you can't have a nightclub in that location. There's just so much residential. And it was out of the way. Was that the challenge? Was it noise? Yeah, noise was a big challenge. And then obviously we had COVID, like, we did a renovation. We had COVID. It just, we had stop, start, stop, start. And then in that period through COVID, like, young, they changed the way they went out. We changed the way we socialised. And we missed a real window of four years of, of that ride, that progression of students. So that was a real challenge. And right now it's, it's, it's at my office. Yeah. So we don't know what we'll do with that. We, we've, that heritage is listed as well. So we're only restricted to what we can do as well. Yeah. So whether, that's why a house is a really simple fix. You can only go up X amount of stories. Yeah. You know, it could be another gastropub or a restaurant. Fanny's high tea. The funny thing is, I left Nui for 20 years. Yeah. And came back a couple of years ago. And it's like amazing what's shifted and changed. Like, ooh, this is here now. And that's amazing. But a lot of stuff doesn't feel like it is to you. And maybe that's the age. Yeah, it is. It would be. That's what I, I got the person earlier on to, when they were younger, where they used to go. And I said, tell me where you go now. And it was like, wow. Where we go now is over here. Yeah. It's not this thing. What's that mean? Or like the suburbs. Like, Adamstown, Newlands. Like that kind of. Yeah, okay. Yep. Like, Fennance Hotel or something. Yeah. Like, the ABC or Wests or. Why would you ever come into this park? I guess it's just like, the familiarity. Like, access, we can walk. Like, to Wests, I've got a playground, park. When would you come into the East, like, to watch a show or go to a event? So, I mean, I would come without the kids for a lot of these things. Yeah, there you go. That's the big challenge. Yeah. But also the access. That's struggling so much. Parking or just like, no, just access to go in with kids. Yep. The only ones we go to Modus. Yep. We go to Mayfield Bolo. Because it's, you can just, my kids are in terms too. Yep. So, they need a bit of space. But there's not, I mean, you go to Wests and do all that sort of stuff. But, yeah, it's interesting. To be honest, local, like, state government with the vibrancy reports of liquor licensing has been really good now. Right, yeah. It used to be a huge problem to have kids, teenagers in licensed areas and outdoor spaces. I'm, like, straight up not allowed to have anyone under a teen. Yeah. Yeah, they see us coming and, like, boop, boop. Yeah. And that's a big walk. And, like, so everyone was so guarded to kind of be a family-friendly venue. And it's super important now. Because parents want to go have a beer, watch a van, let their kids be more old. We did a, like, we were sitting there the other day at this place and we were like, what's the revenue loss of you not having two extra beers? And if you think about it, there's four dads there. And, like, that's, you know, that's eight beers. That's a lot. That's, that's, and if you add that up over time and over, you know, I think it's a thing. That adds up, yeah. ABC has just been fantastic for that. Like, those that have spaces. Yep. Listen, the ABC is fantastic. Yeah. Probably hurt a lot of the other pubs in that area. Yep. Because then they just had the floor space and they opened it up and it allowed people to run. See, Soap Club Katara, that's what, recently re-amp so we thought we'll try that for Anzac Day. They've got these happening, they've got that. And it was such a, I mean, I don't want to say, but, like, the experience there, you've still got to go and have a good experience and have the kind of facilities you need, have the vibe and the layout and all of that. And we thought we won't go back because it isn't that kind of vibe. Yeah. But, like, if you could activate more places on the beach with, like, you know, outdoor corners and bar areas and, like, more of that kind of... Did you go to the New Annual when they did the live stuff down there? Yeah. How'd you find that? Amazing. That was cool. We took the kids there. They should do that all. It's not hard to do that all the time. Maybe not that fast. It's not hard to do that all the time. You go anywhere in Europe, there's always a bit on the beach. Like, things like that, opening it up and, like, allowing pop-up little bars on the beach. Like, we can do that quite comfortably. Lighthouse. Lighthouse, yeah. Lighthouse. We've got to a session. We haven't bought Scratzy, right? You can do way more stuff. I've always gone past, every time I go past here, where they pull the boat, I'm like, let's put a bar there. Like, you know, you look at Bobby's servehouse, I'm like, this is the most beautiful bar. I just dropped something there. At the, um, what's the bike shop one? I see them hand out the coffees on the puddles. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Onto the tugs. Yeah. Yeah, things like that. But I reckon all the way along here, like, you know, I just was in Queensland, but I had all these cool little food cards and, like, just like that. And that was at night time. I think it was daytime at night. I was just, like, moving with people connecting in safe spaces, all for the right reasons, I would think. Sounds like, do we need a water park or do we need something? Well, a water park. Yeah, there's lots of parks coming up. Yeah, they're going to be done soon. That'll be pretty wild. And I think just more little activations and better kind of communication of what's actually on, on demand with relevant information. It's like we're playing your day. It doesn't need to be permanent. Like, pop-ups are cool. Yeah, it is. And people have short attention spans and changing ways. Most businesses are pop-ups these days. They struggle. But why not support actual pop-ups? That's why I always take the council, but it's active at the surf club. So if you've got an idea, because, like, a great question, I was like, what comes first in creating a successful nightlife scene? The people willing to go out or the businesses willing to open? I'm an opportunist. I see opportunities. I'm like, and people create that. And I always think, like, pop-up restaurants and businesses, like, an opportunity would be, like, you know, someone want to open their business and test the water. Where would they go to do that for three months and not put their house on the line and do that? There's so much creativity, and I think we need to harness that because eventually you have all these little piles around the city, but if X amount of businesses start shutting down, they become a red dot. I don't go, why? It's graffiti. It's like, how hard is, like, a big town stretch around there? So you've got to really start. The small businesses is a really important part on that and encouraging people like the pop-ups, like, pop-ups are a really good word, and a weekend thing where people can really cut their teeth and get a feel for it, so identifying, like, spaces like that and making it cost-effective. And not only that, when you do a pop-up, if you're a food truck or anything, they still can lose money. Like, it's quite, and maybe when we do these things, there needs to be a guarantee versus, you know, so they're not going to go out from their families and lose money because they won't come back. If people aren't there, and we need them to kind of survive, so. It was, like, when there was Roxanne's and Blue Kahuna's, like, right in town. Like, they were, like, for a good, like, I'd say, like, six months, they were, like, pretty, it was pretty consistently, like, good foot traffic in that area, and there was people there. And now both of them are closed. And, like, I'll walk through there on a Saturday and I'll just be dead. So, when the Victoria Theatre opens up, which will be probably another year and a half, you'll see this, you'll see that work. So, the Victoria Theatre's owned by the Enmore, the guys that own that, and there'll be a 1500 capacity venue, which will probably like music. So, what's the Civic? No, the Victoria Theatre. What's the, what's the capacity? Civic's the same. That's about, yeah, a bit more, yeah. So, is that the same? They'll take a little bit of business off that, but they'll obviously get a few more international. So, you'll see, I think the whole precinct there will be, will be better. So, you might get a little bit more action there, but, like, they'll, they'll open in a couple of years, so, yeah, I just feel like we're so connected, we feel like we're connected so far, but we're not. Suvo. Is that still there? No. I was going to say, that's a name I haven't seen for a long time. No, there's a couple of, it's been like four different restaurants since that month. I don't know, I don't know where they pulled the map from. Huh? I don't know where they got this map from, but, yeah. There's a couple, not, there's a lot of venues not on there, but. This is a dumb question, but is there a place to look at a venue map? Like, I know everyone uses Google and all that sort of stuff, but is there, you know, in some places, like tourist destinations, they'll have a map of all of the breweries or the wineries and stuff, like you said. I think there's too much of a, like, a turnover and a turnover of places to have something. I think Hunter Hunt is probably the most, the most reliable store. There is now, like, obviously, we have Midtown Precinct, which is very up-to-date, and you've got Newcastle Lease and all the, all the precincts opening up that are pretty active up today, but you've got to look at four different pages to get the info. Hunter Hunt would be the best one, yeah. I think so. They are good, too. Yeah. The Lass doesn't make it on there. The Lass? Yeah. Well, it should be now. It's open at the moment. The Lass has been going really crazy, isn't it? The Lass has been good. Yeah, it's the table. Table tennis. So that's, wasn't that going to change hands or something? It has changed hands, but the owner, there was a lessee in there who left, and then the owner, his owner operator. Yeah. And they're doing good stuff. They're doing a lot of tech hours, a lot of outdoor shows. It's unreal. They're, like, they're, like, at capacity most weekends, Fridays and Saturdays. Yeah. Yeah. It's really good. And going to, like, 3 a.m. every weekend. Yep. I've heard it's for lunch now. Which, unfortunately, they're about to get a lot of high rises in that area. Well, that's the, that's the problem. Yeah. They're going to have to, they'll have to do something about it, because they've got a rule. They've got a rule. They've got a rule. There's a lot of money to last. No. No. No. No. No. No. It's Mexican. Do you? Can you hear it? Yeah. It's good. It's great. Yeah. It is good. I own King Street Hotel. I've had that for 20 years. Yeah, bring back the Cambridge. Not one resident back in the day. We used to open up our, everyone walks in and goes, these venues smell so bad. I'm like, we have to have every window, like, our acoustic panelling, and it doesn't allow us to breathe fresh air. Yeah. Like, it does. We open our doors. Back in the day, we'd have every door open. Yeah, they complain that they have to shut their doors and like, what? How do you find the traffic? So the soundproofing there is pretty, pretty tough. But a lot of it is, like, moving traffic. They're lucky. Yeah. They're lucky. Yeah. I think Mark, you can put a red dot on Mark at town. Someone's already done that. Yeah. Oh, it's not on there, but, you know. Yeah, further in town. Yeah. Um. But yeah. But it is something that they've done for, like, there's a lot of venues that have taken something old and made it new. It's a pretty small venue. So, like, daylights. I love when they do the Ravella did, like, outfits at Ravella. Yeah. So you can actually see the space while having a nice dinner. Yeah. It's a good combination. So when, like, two businesses do some kind of connect. Yeah. I own Alfie's. Okay. I'm one of the owners of Alfie's restaurant. Oh. Good choice. Yeah. Well done. Thank you. No, no. Opportunity. I've been here for a long, long time. I've moved here 20 years ago purely. I was 26 and 40 and I just love Newcastle. They've been here and I just, I'm a sucker. I can't say no. So what made you use Ravella's to, like, kind of connect with them? One of my friends bought the wedding venue. Yeah. We do the catering there for the wedding. Yeah. Yeah. But I think given, like, had you had that event where you could come and try it. Try it, yeah. It was fantastic. Yeah. Yeah. And that's awesome. Like, yeah, we do a lot of co-labs as well. Yeah. The Hunter Valley we do a bunch as well. So hospitality is just half at the moment. Yeah. And it's going to be a lot harder, unfortunately, but. Yeah. What happened to New York? Yeah. What about Bernie's? Bernie's is, yeah. That whole street along the Midtown area there is really good. Is that an interesting thing? Yeah. No bias. Yeah. Yeah. Well, it is, you know. Like, to be honest, it's one of the most prominent kind of happening kind of spaces where we are. And that's obviously the area where they want to control the special entertainment precinct. But I think that is a draw card for people going out. You want to go to an activated area where you've got a few different choices. Yeah, you do. Because back in the day, you would go out and you'd go to, like, Crossbite. You'd go to the Great Northern. You'd go to, like, Crossbite. You'd go to, like, Crossbite. Yes. You'd go to, like, Crossbite. Yes. You'd go to, like, Crossbite. Yes. You'd go to, like, Crossbite. Yes. You'd go to, like, Crossbite. Yes. You'd go to, like, Crossbite. Yes. You'd go to, like, Crossbite. Yes. You'd go to, like, Crossbite. Yes. You'd go to, like, Crossbite. Yes. You'd go to, like, Crossbite. Yes. You'd go to a cocktail on honey supper. Yes. Like, I wanted to take her out for a cocktail. We couldn't do a cocktail. Was that... Why? Because... I think there was some kind of thing between, or some places weren't allowed to sell cocktails and then they had to, like, stop serving alcohol at a certain point. Yeah. We couldn't do... We couldn't do shots. We couldn't do cocktails or shots after 10 o'clock. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, we had a lockout mall. We started an entertainment precinct where we had to scan everyone's... We started that between our own businesses to... Yeah. And it was a real, real fight. Yeah. The same government now is giving us a lot of money... Yeah. ...to undo what we did. It's like... These memories stick and it's like, well, I don't have the confidence to go out... No, to go out. Because I've had that many experiences where I've either been stranded and can't get home. It's been, like, a dud vibe. Yeah. You know. Yeah. It's been a... I still think the changes will come quicker than, like, it has over the last 10 years. I think the castles... Do they still have the, like, little, like, the tuk-tuk things that you used to drive? No. No. Yeah, things like that. That was so cool because it would connect people to the places. I had to talk about this. Yeah. The guy who started that was... Had the coffee shop. Yeah. He still owns it where he hands the tugboats. Ah, that one. The coffee on the stick. Yeah. He started that. And there was, like, the music in it and the lights and that was sick. We'd sponsor it so we could get them from out there. It was so good. And we lived, at the time, we lived in Hamilton. Yeah. And that was such a good kind of way to... Yeah, it was cool. To just... I think they should be free. Yeah. So we could just get them all the time. I reckon they're cool. Yeah. Yeah. It's funny. Were you here when Newcastle tried the lime bikes on the weekend? Have you ever seen that? No, lime bikes. Lime bikes. You know, they look like the free electrical bikes. They dropped about 20 off. I think that's been a big discussion all night. And never came back. Yeah. They're awesome in the cold case. Yeah, they are. Yeah, they are. Or in Canberra, the Hobbit. Hobbit. Yeah. Yeah. The scooters. They're dangerous though. No, no, no, not the scooters. They do them around this lane. They're not scooters. They're not scooters. It's like a plop. They're on the floor. They're on the floor. They said this is too crazy. Yeah, right, right. And plus, they could drop them in so many locations. Like red dot locations and not pick them up. Where is it? Brisbane. I've got a couple of red dots. You're walking past everything. Yeah, you're walking past and you're connected. Whereas Newcastle are very spread out. Yeah. So, people would take them out somewhere with the heights, you know. Like, getting home. Like, that was generally, to get them from one A to B. They said, oh, this isn't. We're not. They just went to show like that didn't work. There was no connection. Yeah, how we're not just there. Even though it's like, it's such a small space. Like, I mean, I don't drive anywhere longer than like five or ten minutes. Yeah. Whereas in like, it's wild to think that they're in that short space of time. There's so many spaces that you wouldn't stop and go through. Yeah. So, a different kind of put a comment here. Yes. Yeah. It's a... Yeah, it's interesting. Yeah. What's your favourite venues? Yeah. Mine? Yeah. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You can only keep one. What if someone in government got in and said you can only have one venue or...? Oh, I keep... I keep... I keep King Street. That's never happened. Like, never... That's never happened. That's never happened. Yeah. The funny thing is, it's a lot of... It's been there. Yeah. It's been there for 25 years. We've had it for 25 years. It's never been kicked out of there. Nah. It's good. Good music. Yeah. We've got that, but it's like, it's... It's a part of something. Like, you know, it's a real big culture. And it's not for everyone, but it's for a certain part of your life. Yeah. And then they move on. And we've... All of our... We have our... Our lawyer now used to work for us there. Like, we've put a lot of people through. Yeah. I really like it. But it's not for everyone at a certain point in time in your life. But... It's a pretty important part of a nightlife culture. And there's not many nightclubs around. But didn't... Didn't Chris used to make that? Chris would say, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He ran out a little rock bar, so... So the guy who owns Kittetsu. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Used to work at King Street. A lot of them, yeah. That's been pretty simple. How have the other rooms been? Pretty... Yeah, pretty good. Yeah. This one's been pretty hard. Yeah. Cause then people are like, where do I go? I don't know. I'll do this. Like, it's not... Yeah, but it's also hard to... Oh, did it become it? No, I didn't think so. But people have found it a little hard to navigate. Cause they don't really know how they... It's weird. It's a bit of a tough one. It's been a bit of a tough one. The only need is a young conference centre. Yeah. You know what they were thinking? Yeah. The guy, Jerry Swartz, who owns obviously the Ridges. Yeah, yeah. That's going to be the conference centre. He still has plans to do that. Yeah. It'll be good. So you know officers. You've got the Ridges. Where are we? Where's... The Ridges is here. Yeah. So he owns all this land. That's funny. Yeah. So he owns all this and that. So here's going to be a conference centre. He still plans for it. Yeah. Hotel going along here. Yeah. So that's where he's going to do a conference centre. That's the same guy that owns... That's Jerry Swartz who owns the post office. He owns like 10,000 beds in Sydney. He's got all the Sofitels. Novatels. I love that sledgehammer thing you did with the NBN. DA's activated. He just dropped it and walked off. Yeah. So we actually bought Argyle House off him back in the day. Yeah. But that's what he's got playing a convention centre. Yeah. But when he'll build it. You need guys like that. To do something now. You need it. Yeah. He's probably gone. I can't be bothered dealing with the council. I'll do it in 20 years. I don't care. You know like that's the type of like. He doesn't need it. And like passion and opportunity and things is important for people like that. I think it would be fun. Convention centre in the city would be so good. That's why I thought NEX like when they've done that. They're doing high rises for over 55s. Yeah. That whole car bunch mates would have been amazing. Put something big right there. Build on top of it. Yeah. Yeah. To seek another opportunity. Is that going to be an over 55s? Yeah. Yeah. Get the lift straight down. Can I just highlight. I reckon that's part of why some of these things have been coming harder. Is that there's that movement. There is yeah. Definitely. Yeah. But with all the new apartments and that kind of density that's gone up, has anyone actually noticed that there's more vibrant times than the people in the city or is it the pace? I think it's I think if you go around on a weekday and weeknight like they're dining out more than young people. Yeah. Just because they've got the disposable income. Yeah. So a lot of people changing their strategy. I don't think it's more vibrant probably. Like there'll be cafes. It's cafes seem to be doing more well. Yeah. But I'd love to know all the stats and who's buying it. Yeah. I mean I at my venue I talk to a lot of very rich people and like they like the people who like there's a regular that comes in who lives in Skye which is the big building. Sort of just like above the rock shop. The really tall apartment building. And they own two apartments in there that they live in. And then they just bought three apartments in the brand new. Right. Right near the cathedral. And then they bought one across the road from the market town. And then they bought one near the last. So they bought in every single new development. But no one's living there. No one's living there. Right. Empty vans. They've just got it as Airbnb's. Yeah. So they're not like no one's actually going to be living there. So like. Yeah. Yeah. But it will be interesting once the East End's done with the Victorian Theatre and all the other apartments there. It'll be really interesting to see how that kind of kicks. It will. And then we'll be there but. It's pretty cool.